Plans for a new cinema, smaller shopping area and 'office hub’ for Bolton (From The Bolton News)

Keep Cliff Morris and the rest of the cuncill spongers away from any plans for Bolton town center and the plans might work , otherwise forget it.

". . .“narrowly focused” night-time economy along Bradshawgate." That's one way of putting it, "feeding time at the zoo" is another! I question the vlidity of some of the statics in this news piece, ". . . Bolton, Bury and Oldham had improved in the past 10 years. . .". How has Bolton improved in the last 10 years? The town has been in a steady decline for some years now. there's no point in denying that.

The proposals/ideas do sound feasible and could quite conceivably improve the town centre area, though to involve the incompetent Bolton council would be the death knell.
Perhaps the time has come to abolish the peripheral councils of Manchester and bring forward,what is clearly the long term plan for a Greater Manchester council.

No doubt we'll have to pay to park to visit the cinema meaning everyone would go to either Middlebrook or Tonge Valley instead.

The success of the town centre, pubs, shops, restaurants, cinemas, *all* of it, rests upon the availability of free parking.

The town centre will end up being taken over by takeaways. W ho wants to live in a flat/apt surrounded by takeaways open till after 2am. Will become a bigger dustbin than it is already. Cliff Morris and co are a waste of time.....get rid.

steveG wrote:
The proposals/ideas do sound feasible and could quite conceivably improve the town centre area, though to involve the incompetent Bolton council would be the death knell.
Perhaps the time has come to abolish the peripheral councils of Manchester and bring forward,what is clearly the long term plan for a Greater Manchester council.

You certainly know how to wind Boltonians up, we are an independent Borough Council, the Gtr Man council was tried , it was not liked by the people of most of the Borough's and was quite rightly abolished, never to return again.

Pity we did'nt abolish the name Gtr Man., South Lancashire with North Cheshire is a more accurate and probably more acceptable name for the region.

MarkAllRead wrote:
No doubt we'll have to pay to park to visit the cinema meaning everyone would go to either Middlebrook or Tonge Valley instead.

The success of the town centre, pubs, shops, restaurants, cinemas, *all* of it, rests upon the availability of free parking.

and a lack of thugs attempting to commit theft or serious harm to you....so forget it...SHOP AT THE TRAFFORD CENTRE INSTEAD...cinema, restaurants, safe warm and free parking for all...problem solved

“Go out in Bolton town centre on any day of the week and you will see people gathering and it’s about providing the right environment for people to do that.

That is very true, people gathering, most spitting, swearing, speaking as though they have never been to school...a perfect environment that is what Bolton town centre is!!!!!!

Keith Davies,director of development and regeneration.What a joke,between him and the FAT MAN they have systematicaly brought Bolton to it's knees. Incompetent,inept,qu
estionable finangling??? self serving morons.I think Kevan Davies would be more suited for the job than Keith Davies,he has more passion, more drive,more following and he seems to be a honest person.As for the FAT CLOWN Bolton should elect a chimp to take his place, they say they can be highly intelegent and faithful.

Makes a change from moaning about bins or gritting!

This sort of thinking looks like turning Bolton into a student based centre, I avoid shopping in the town centre due to the expense of parking! Parking is extensive and free at middlebrook also gates and trinity retail park. why do i want to go to town centre shops?

''including events like.. poetry to appeal to the town centre’s large student population.''

That made me laugh.

when the name clff morris pops up you know it will be a **** up,he puts the kiss off death on everything.

So we have pubs and clubs closing all over Britain at a horrific rate making more people unemployed. Its been proved with the cost of alcohol rising that people cannot afford to go out anymore, so how will building a cinema and new clubs and cafe's help? I you local humble pub has gone for a burton due to the curent financial climate how the hell will new ones survive in town where it costs extra to park or get a taxi to and from?

We live equi-distance to both Bolton and Warrington, but must admit we usually go to Warrington over Winter as now everything is handily under cover in the large new shopping centre. A couple of weeks ago we went to Bolton for the first time in quite a while. It was around 13.00 on a SUnday. The town centre was deserted, around a third of all the shops looked closed down permanently, and another third or so, closed because it was Sunday. It was incredibly depresing and we won't be going back for a while. I don't know what the answer is but there must be some reason that Manchester, the Trafford Centre and Warringot can be busy on a Sunday, when Bolton is a ghost town.

I applaud the fact that action is being taken to infrastructure. To me it is not as bad as is made out and not all of it is required. Sometimes it is the culture that is the issue, not the physical aspects of a town centre.

The reason i rarely visit the town centre...especially at night is the threat to physical safety. The sheer number of idiots look to spoil your night out is amazing. Is it not possible for Boltoners to go out without looking to thump someone because they vaguely looked in your direction? A town full of neanderthals and frankly, you get what you deserve.

It's no wonder that if you are educated and handle yourself with decorum & class...Bolton is no place for you. Which leaves us with the dregs of society looking around for their next victim. Maybe a heavy handed police crackdown to restore some law and order to the nightlife will produce more beneficial results than spending more money we dont have on more infrastructure that is not necessarily the answer.

It may not be a vote winner but Boltoners who populate the pubs and clubs at night really have to ask themselves...are we just a bunch of moronic imbeciles that seek nothing more than getting hammered, battering some victim who was unfortunate to be standing in the wrong place at the wrong time and then taking home a questionably looking woman of ill repute whos morals are where her knickers will end up...round her ankles.

The people of Bolton have a lot to answer, not necessarily the elected officials. Ask yourself this "what do i do that brings a positive to Bolton?" There are many out there that wont be able to answer this basic and fundamental question in a way that they can be proud about.

Bolton is going to hell in a handcart because of the ill educated morons within it. We know who they are. You only have yourselves to blame.

PGtips67 wrote:
''including events like.. poetry to appeal to the town centre’s large student population.''

That made me laugh.

I have not stopped laughing...and I read the article over an hour ago!!!!

Phil from Smithills wrote:

steveG wrote: The proposals/ideas do sound feasible and could quite conceivably improve the town centre area, though to involve the incompetent Bolton council would be the death knell. Perhaps the time has come to abolish the peripheral councils of Manchester and bring forward,what is clearly the long term plan for a Greater Manchester council.

You certainly know how to wind Boltonians up, we are an independent Borough Council, the Gtr Man council was tried , it was not liked by the people of most of the Borough's and was quite rightly abolished, never to return again. Pity we did'nt abolish the name Gtr Man., South Lancashire with North Cheshire is a more accurate and probably more acceptable name for the region.

Bolton is a unitary authority not a peripheral council of Manchester as you insultingly describe. I'm not sure where you've dug that up from but if look more closely we don't even share a boundary with the City of Manchester. I love the idea of shire county names returning though as someone suggested!.

The elephant in the room here, of course, is not "online retailing" but the phenomenal and uncurbed growth of Manchester - the intentional result of the move to create a city, with one centre, out of a conurbation.

This was always bound to have dire consequences for the big Lancashire county boroughs, which for most of the last century (and before) had little to do with Manchester, other than in its role as the market for cotton.

Bolton, still by far the biggest centre outside Manchester, has obviously suffered the most markedly in this drive to focus eveything on the supposed "regional centre".

The rescue plan begins with the restoration of unitary status, such as Warrington has. I doubt the present Council set-up has either the cojones or the gumption, though.

Honest_Joe wrote:
We live equi-distance to both Bolton and Warrington, but must admit we usually go to Warrington over Winter as now everything is handily under cover in the large new shopping centre. A couple of weeks ago we went to Bolton for the first time in quite a while. It was around 13.00 on a SUnday. The town centre was deserted, around a third of all the shops looked closed down permanently, and another third or so, closed because it was Sunday. It was incredibly depresing and we won't be going back for a while. I don't know what the answer is but there must be some reason that Manchester, the Trafford Centre and Warringot can be busy on a Sunday, when Bolton is a ghost town.

the answer is simply known as Middlebrook... that has been the reason for Bolton's decline over the last 10 years...

Here we are again!! Just the same as the Government. They just do not listen.

I have said before - Go back to when Bolton was vibrant and its people were proud of it, then proceed forward to when it started to go wrong and you will have your answer on how to put things right. Admittedly the whole country is suffering from economic failures but for heavens sake, look around Bolton not just the townhall square! it is overflowing with boarded up empty buildings, appalling takeaways that need to be closed on hygienic grounds (look above and behind and you will see that they are not kept in a clean state). On public transport you can hear comments from commuters on how disgusting Bolton has become.

I have said if before and I will say it again. The people on the council are too young or completely blind to remember how Bolton used to be. They have nothing to compare the present state of Bolton. Look at the photographs of old Bolton the streets were packed with people shopping in the plentiful shoe shops on Newport Street, Bolton Market was how people loved it - up the side streets, around the back of the current market. It was much larger and it has been destroyed. How they can bring coach loads in to visit is beyond me. I would be extremely angry if I had paid for a coach ticket to visit what is a joke. The market Hall was filled with people viewing the stalls or sitting having a cup of tea or a snack. Now we are left with an empty walkway with shops but no customers!!!

How many time do we Boltonians have to point this out and for the Council to pay heed?

How many Boltonians would agree with me that the Council should give listening to us a try. I am positive it would only get better not worse.

Stop bragging about the shambles that is Bolton. A new shopping area and cinema is not the answer. Work with what you have got, repair the damage by replacing the old Market Hall and see what happens. Increase the market further onto the bus station. Offices will be left empty you just watch.

People seem quite happy to have a go at my beloved Bolton but I've not seen one suggestion as to how we can improve it. If Morris and Davies are so obviously bad at their jobs (and I believe they are) let’s get rid of them. We all want to see Bolton thrive but it’s quite obvious that the current ideas are not working.

Why does Bolton have to be a shopping centre? If we want to shop we can go to the likes of the Middlebrook or Trafford Centre that meet everybody’s requirements for traditional shopping. Go to Bury, Warrington, Wigan etc and you will see exactly the same shops so let Bolton provide a different experience from all the others.

Totnes (in Devon) drove Costa Coffee out because the residents wanted independent traders. If the big boys don’t want to be part of Bolton lets provide an area for small independent traders to be given their chance and seek government help to get them on their feet. Bolton can be a beacon for towns up and down the country to fight back against invisible forces that seem to be trying to destroy our towns and their history.

Let’s encourage people to want to stay and relax in our town centre. If they feel scared let’s insist in the police force taking action to take that fear away. The police are there to protect and serve so let’s make sure they do exactly that. It won’t take much to rid our town of a small minority who threaten the well being of the rest of us.

If we want families to come in to Bolton let’s provide the entertainment and services they want. A multiplex is an obvious way but kids love the simple things so well supervised play areas, ice/roller rinks and the like would be just the start.

Free parking is an obvious must but how about free trains or buses to bring in families from outlying districts or even other towns?

The country is crying out for change so let’s put Bolton at the forefront and turn our town in to a place where everyone wants to come and everyone wants to be like. The opportunity is there so let’s take it.

What makes some in Bolton think that the town centre is any different than any other town ?

It would do some of you good to live in Wigan which is not a patch on Bolton.

Greater Manchester does not exist.

It is nothing but a figment of a bureaucrat's wet dream - a completely artificial invention having no historical basis, and no natural geographical boundaries.

Bolton is not in Greater Manchester, and it is not in Manchester.


Bolton is in the Lancashire County Palatine, and its postal addresses confirn that fact.

The Lancashire County Palatine was never abolished.

Lancashire's boundaries are: the River Mersey in the South, the River Duddon in the North, the Irish Sea in the West, and the Pennine chain otherwise known as "The Backbone of England" .

See: http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/List_of_pla
ces_historically_in_
Lancashire.

What is the use of family friendly businesses, cinemas etc, when at 11 in the morning in Bradshawgate, I can see people staggering aroung in the doorways of licenced premises with bottles and cans in their hands?

I wouldn't want to bring my family anywhere near that part of Bolton town centre during the day.

Let alone bring them to see a concert at the Parish Church or Bank Street Chapel, when they face going home at 10 pm trying to catch a bus amid the hordes of drink and drug sodden idiots.

More bad news for the good people of Bolton. Gregory & Porritts Knowsley St are closing down. very soon the town will not need traffic wardens, now that would be good news

It will never work, just look at the new ellesmere centre in walden, 2000 free car parking spaces and the place is dead.
http://www.theellesm
erecentre.co.uk/

Strong transport links have the councillors every sat on the m61 m60 junction between the hours of 7-10 am. Maybe in cliffs world ! As for the new interchange the mainline runs in the opposite direction to the west coast mainline Wigan have that advantage at least. Where all Doomed with these clowns at the helm.

Strong transport links have the councillors every sat on the m61 m60 junction between the hours of 7-10 am. Maybe in cliffs world ! As for the new interchange the mainline runs in the opposite direction to the west coast mainline Wigan have that advantage at least. Where all Doomed with these clowns at the helm.

boltonnut wrote:
Keith Davies,director of development and regeneration.What a joke,between him and the FAT MAN they have systematicaly brought Bolton to it's knees. Incompetent,inept,qu

estionable finangling??? self serving morons.I think Kevan Davies would be more suited for the job than Keith Davies,he has more passion, more drive,more following and he seems to be a honest person.As for the FAT CLOWN Bolton should elect a chimp to take his place, they say they can be highly intelegent and faithful.

keith Davies degeneration executive for Bolton. Buck only knows what the french reivera will think of him and morris. All I can think of is the film dirty rotten scoundrels without humour or charisma. The only charisma cliff uses is to wipe his backside.

To ALL non-believers that Greater Manchester is not legally a county in its own right......

Greater Manchester is a metropolitan county in North West England, with a population of 2.68 million. It was created on 1 April 1974 as a result of the Local Government Act 1972.

For the 12 years following 1974 the county had a two-tier system of local government; district councils shared power with the Greater Manchester County Council. The county council was abolished in 1986, and so its districts (the metropolitan boroughs) effectively became unitary authority areas. However, the metropolitan county has CONTINUED TO EXIST IN LAW and as a geographic frame of reference, and as a ceremonial county, has a Lord Lieutenant and a High Sheriff.

Several county-wide services were co-ordinated through the Association of Greater Manchester Authorities up until April 2011, when the Greater Manchester Combined Authority was established as the strategic county-wide authority for Greater Manchester, taking on functions and responsibilities for economic development, regeneration and transport.

Unlike most other modern counties (including Merseyside and Tyne and Wear), Greater Manchester was never adopted as a postal county by the Royal Mail. A review in 1973 noted that "Greater Manchester" would be unlikely to be adopted because of confusion with the Manchester post town. The component areas of Greater Manchester held on to their pre-1974 postal counties until 1996, when they were ABOLISHED.[

Keith Davies trip hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmh

Church Wharf, Bolton
This redevelopment project has been awarded by Bolton Council to the joint venture team Ask:Bluemantle. The master plan includes a leisure zone, hotel, business quarter, retail zone and residential

Bolton Council’s director of development and regeneration, informs us that "Town centres have always been an important place for people to gather. "

Whatever this man earns, he his definitely value for money for the taxpayer!

The plans seem a good idea ( thats if they get of the ground ) Manchester has not let many regeneration grants move out of their city

Words from the Reddish MP

Although the administrative boundaries of Lancashire have been altered a number of times throughout history, the most radical being in April 1974 as a result of the Local Government Act 1972; most people are not aware that the Duchy of Lancaster remains as a legal entity and administrative unit, and encompasses the entirety of the present day administrative Counties of Lancashire, Greater Manchester and Merseyside (including those parts formerly in Cheshire and Yorkshire West Riding prior to 1974).

The optimum word is administrative. As the Duchy of Lancaster now covers more than the traditional county we are still in the traditional county of Lancashire.

Sorry, but the report is complete 'pie in the sky'. Writing wonderful ideas to justify your job is one thing but doing them is entirely different.

On-line sales are hitting 16% year on year so how they are planning on going against that baffles me somewhat... you'll never get a retailer in a bricks and mortar to compete with a virtual warehouse. People are becoming more and more savvy with saving money.

What ever happened to all the planned developments we were promised for sites which have laid derelict for years now?

The reported should be filed under 'W' for Wishful Thinking.

I will believe it when I see it in action but for now I will carry on shopping in Manchester as it says in the article only '12 minutes TO get to Manchester'. Funny that they didn't put 'only 12 minutes TO bolton from Manchester'

Does anyone remember when there were signs on the motorway saying you are now entering Greater Manchester . and do you remember when they were taken down because there is no such County called Greater Manchester well i do . Bolton and the other Towns even Manchester are in Lancashire and always will be . one Bolton is by far the Biggest Town in the Country and not much smaller than Manchester . in size Fact. the other Manchester would lose out big time if Bolton ever became what it once was the Biggest and best town in the North west Fact . so when the next Local and national Elections come around please Vote for the Party UKIP. as they will put Bolton back where it belongs at the top Fact so all stop moaning and vote for UKIP and let us all see change

in which case you might aswell have upgraded the abc cinema instead of demolishing it and building apartments! if you were to lower the rates then it is more likely you would get more shops opening with more diversity since the market hall was done up, parking prices increased and more pound shops and coffee shops opened the people realised there is nothing to even bother to travel to the town center for, if you go to bury or manchester you can spend a day looking at all the different shops pay low rates if anything to park and get everything you want in one place there is also the architecture to look at and not grime and pigeons, there is free travel in manchester to go around the center and low bus fares bolton is lacking in all areas and has tried to make a better appearance and it hasnt worked they have lost too much custom and hasnt thought about its customer age range.
People came to bolton for the old market hall and the quirky shops where you could get different things in little family run shops and you could guarentee you could get certain things from certain shops but now they have been forced to close and relocate all because the council got too gready the same with the water place that useed to attract lots of custom and instead of helping the business it was more easy to close it demolish it and make a car park for the invisable people to visit the ghost town.
i think someone needs to wake up and look at the apearence of the town and its surroundings, pot hole heaven, overgrown weeds on st peters way (very inviting) closed shops looking trampy, and people allowed to shop in onesies come on we are supposed to look welcoming not like the set of shameless.

Phil from Smithills wrote:
The plans seem a good idea ( thats if they get of the ground ) Manchester has not let many regeneration grants move out of their city

Words from the Reddish MP

Although the administrative boundaries of Lancashire have been altered a number of times throughout history, the most radical being in April 1974 as a result of the Local Government Act 1972; most people are not aware that the Duchy of Lancaster remains as a legal entity and administrative unit, and encompasses the entirety of the present day administrative Counties of Lancashire, Greater Manchester and Merseyside (including those parts formerly in Cheshire and Yorkshire West Riding prior to 1974).

The optimum word is administrative. As the Duchy of Lancaster now covers more than the traditional county we are still in the traditional county of Lancashire.

Funnily enough Queen Elizabeth II, aka Duchy Of Lancaster, is only a land-owner of which the monies goes towards the paying of the Royal Family.

Phil, it seems you are playing with words as the Duchy also holds land in Cheshire and in Yorkshire - so due to the fact that the Duchy owns those lands they are also Lancashire?

Well, you and I know that it doesn't class those lands as Lancashire. So in reality the same goes towards Merseyside, Greater Manchester an Lancashire. The administartion of Lancashire is Preston, The administration of Merseyside is Southport and teh admitstration of Greater Manchester is Manchester - Blackpool and Blacburn are their on administrtive areas and are not part of Lancshre, either - just the same that Warrtington is not part of Chesire.

I do believe you will have to learn the difference, Phil, between the word County and the words Palatine County as there are BIG differences of the two!!

Rememberscarborough wrote:
People seem quite happy to have a go at my beloved Bolton but I've not seen one suggestion as to how we can improve it. If Morris and Davies are so obviously bad at their jobs (and I believe they are) let’s get rid of them. We all want to see Bolton thrive but it’s quite obvious that the current ideas are not working.

Why does Bolton have to be a shopping centre? If we want to shop we can go to the likes of the Middlebrook or Trafford Centre that meet everybody’s requirements for traditional shopping. Go to Bury, Warrington, Wigan etc and you will see exactly the same shops so let Bolton provide a different experience from all the others.

Totnes (in Devon) drove Costa Coffee out because the residents wanted independent traders. If the big boys don’t want to be part of Bolton lets provide an area for small independent traders to be given their chance and seek government help to get them on their feet. Bolton can be a beacon for towns up and down the country to fight back against invisible forces that seem to be trying to destroy our towns and their history.

Let’s encourage people to want to stay and relax in our town centre. If they feel scared let’s insist in the police force taking action to take that fear away. The police are there to protect and serve so let’s make sure they do exactly that. It won’t take much to rid our town of a small minority who threaten the well being of the rest of us.

If we want families to come in to Bolton let’s provide the entertainment and services they want. A multiplex is an obvious way but kids love the simple things so well supervised play areas, ice/roller rinks and the like would be just the start.

Free parking is an obvious must but how about free trains or buses to bring in families from outlying districts or even other towns?

The country is crying out for change so let’s put Bolton at the forefront and turn our town in to a place where everyone wants to come and everyone wants to be like. The opportunity is there so let’s take it.

Let us not do this...help by turning Bolton into a greater ghost town than it already is...leave it to those who wish to attack, abuse and do their dealings on its streets...shop somewhere else and make the council leaders and greedy landlords pay for their years of selfish taking...

SADTOWN wrote:
More bad news for the good people of Bolton. Gregory & Porritts Knowsley St are closing down. very soon the town will not need traffic wardens, now that would be good news

Many a happy day spent with my mother in G & P's...not really though as a child I was bored and forever being told not to touch the items on sale...but good to see another retailer moving out less income for the council and definitely less income for any landlord involved...which retailer next...maybe next would be appropriate!!!!

The grass is always greener elsewhere where shopping is concerned!

Flatten the lot and make a runway.

Seriously, the towns a **** hole, no free parking, no decent shops, turn the whole thing into offices and leave the shopping to the guys who know how to do it.

JustBecause wrote:
Flatten the lot and make a runway.

Seriously, the towns a **** hole, no free parking, no decent shops, turn the whole thing into offices and leave the shopping to the guys who know how to do it.

I AGREE

I am dismayed at yet another scoping exercise report that does not seem to have included in consultation (m)any Bolton residents. There are lots of people in this town who do remember how things used to be and who are not that old either! It seems as if Bolton has lost it's way, lost it's individuality, lost it's soul in the quest to be like others. The town centre is depressing, more so at night, the support for independant traders is little. The lack of support from our very own elected council in listening to real concerns is laughable in it's absence. Maybe the council members themselves do not remember the unique selling points of Bolton and what drew people to visit the town.
I for one would welcome a focus group drawn up by willing Boltonians that are there to put positive action in. There is so much focus on negativity, a line should be drawn, the town centre is a mess, that is the base line. An action plan should be agreed and worked upon, it needn't cost the earth, it needn't be complicated, it just need be a way forward that doesn't rip yet more character from the centre, suck more soul away from the essence of what is Bolton, and yes I do think that certain chief officers should be held accountable.
Come out of your ivory towers and bring the emporer with his new clothes with you!

BWFC71..I feel you must learn between a traditional county and an administrative county the one's that were created in 1974 were simply administrative counties and part of the traditional county of Lancashire which Liverpool, Manchester & Bolton, Blackpool & Preston belong to.
On the other side of the Pennines, they too were divided into administative counties, yet collectivley we still refer to it by it's traditional county name of Yorkshire.
That same principle applies on this side of the Pennines also.

Comment777 wrote:

PGtips67 wrote:
''including events like.. poetry to appeal to the town centre’s large student population.''

That made me laugh.

I have not stopped laughing...and I read the article over an hour ago!!!!

To be fair, the full quotation is "events like comedy nights, music and poetry to appeal to the town centre’s large student population." I'm not sure poetry is expected to do the job on its own. Even so, it's is more popular than you might think; witness John Cooper Clark and Benjamin Zephaniah's successful careers.

The town is dying its plain to see but look at the people walking round the place they're either asylum seekers, Romanian pickpockets and the rest are the cast of Jeremy Kyle. Ive been seeing Bolton turn more like Leigh every year.

How come those arrows for voting up or down comments have disappeared ?

So, councillor Cliff the Stiff blurbs out this comment:

Quote: Cllr Cliff Morris, leader of Bolton Council, said: “This places us in a good position to address the challenges facing the town centre in the future."

Well Cliff, that says to us all that you haven't even started to address the challenges, all created by you and your useless band of half-breeds, that Bolton faces.

The sooner you are gone the better. You're a waste of space, time and an oxygen thief.

Can I busk there?

Bury council will be laughing their socks of to be in competition ! The clowns steering Bolton towns regeneration make Bury an attractive destination.

So Bolton Council signed up Bluemantle as the preferred developer anf Keith degeneration Davies has a trip to France paid for by Bluemantle.

Keith what Bolton wants is plans with start dates a end dates not headlines and pie in the sky dreams whens it going to happen.

Bolton is not in Lancashire and has not been for over forty years.

Do these Boltonians, when sending postcards back home, put Kingdom of Mercia instead of England (or UK) because they refuse to recognise changes?

Most towns that left Lancashire at the same time as Bolton have moved on. Warrington, Widnes, Barrow, Liverpool, Ashton.

What would be so great for Bolton by being in Lancashire? Similar (proper) Lancashire sized towns like Blackburn and Burnley aren't particularly exciting.

How many Boltonians work or shop in Lancaster? The roads and trains to Manchester are full every morning.

Totally incorrect, in 1974 Lancashires's borders were not altered but administrative ones created within the traditional county of Lancashire.

People do put Bolton Lancashire on their cards and other mail,this was Royal Mails preference.

As for towns "Leaving"Lancashire, tell them in Southport and other towns who say Lancashire. My former work collegues from Stockport,Altringham & Hyde said they were Cheshire.

As for the roads & trains to Manchester are full each day, I worked there pre 1974 and they were full then, possibly more so now as much of the grants has been handed to them and the rest of the area left to wither on the vine.

Phil from Smithills wrote:
Totally incorrect, in 1974 Lancashires's borders were not altered but administrative ones created within the traditional county of Lancashire.

People do put Bolton Lancashire on their cards and other mail,this was Royal Mails preference.

As for towns "Leaving"Lancas
hire, tell them in Southport and other towns who say Lancashire. My former work collegues from Stockport,Altringham & Hyde said they were Cheshire.

As for the roads & trains to Manchester are full each day, I worked there pre 1974 and they were full then, possibly more so now as much of the grants has been handed to them and the rest of the area left to wither on the vine.

Funnily enough you have shot yourself in the foot! The footprint fo Lancashire keeps changing all the time and has done over teh centuries - there are quite a few towns along teh Lancashire and "Yorkshire" boundaries that keep swapping every few decades. Plus YOU also state that Lancashire took on parts of Yorkshire and Cheshire!!!!

It is a LEGAL fact that Lancashire did shrink, in size, in 1974 with the creation of Merseyside and Greater Manchester which ARE legal entities and not just administrative!!! One does not need a County Council to be a county!!!!!

With regards to the Post Office. Yes it was their suggestion not to have Greater Manchester as it would be conusing with Manchester, but they requested that Lancashire not be used for teh former towns that now created Greater Manchester - BUT, and it is a big but, the post office did adopt Merseyside for its postal addresses. That aside all counties do NOT have to be written as part of any address, and that has been the case since 1996 - therefore the Post Office do not recognise Counties anymore and as such its a non-starter of an argument. Infact all that is required on an envelope, nowadays are correspondants name, flat number, which floor, name of building ro number of building and the postcode!!!

Can you advise as to how I get to Altringham as I have never heard of the place? I know of an Altrincham, in Trafford, Greater Manchester. But there again confusing Altrincham with Altringham I can see why one does think that Greater Manchester doesn't exist.

ronnell_uk wrote:
Bolton is not in Lancashire and has not been for over forty years.

Do these Boltonians, when sending postcards back home, put Kingdom of Mercia instead of England (or UK) because they refuse to recognise changes?

Most towns that left Lancashire at the same time as Bolton have moved on. Warrington, Widnes, Barrow, Liverpool, Ashton.

What would be so great for Bolton by being in Lancashire? Similar (proper) Lancashire sized towns like Blackburn and Burnley aren't particularly exciting.

How many Boltonians work or shop in Lancaster? The roads and trains to Manchester are full every morning.

we are not mancs
we dont want to be mancs
if you are, move there saddo
BOLTON LANCASHIRE ENGLAND,by the grace of god.

No shooting in the foot for me. Lancashire s borders did not alter in 1974.The Yorkshire parts, for administrative purposes, Rochdale administer. And Gtr Manchester is made up of towns of south Lancashire & north Cheshire ( Altringham, Stockport Hyde) you may well refer to as Gtr Manchester but they say Cheshire.
As I pointed out...on the other side of the Pennines, they too were divided into seperate administative counties but collectively we call it Yorkshire, this principle also applies on this side of the Pennines, its all part of the same 1974 legistlation, no matter what the administrative counties are called ( you may use Gtr Manchester if you wish) collectively we are still all Lancashire.
It was clearly stated at the time by ministers, that these were for administrative purposes and did not alter the borders of the traditional counties. Lancashire this side of the Pennines and Yorkshire on the other.

Greater Manchester Council were Dismantled in 1984 Fact and Bolton was the first council to pull out because Manchester were taking most of the money to help pay off the rent arrears of the Manchester people by £11000.000. Fact . and yes it was set up as a administrative only Fact. the very big company's in Bolton put Lancashire on there Letters and websites Fact. and the Signs that were once put up on the motorways entering Bolton saying you are now entering Greater Manchester. had to be taken down as there is no such County of that Stupid name once again Fact . so to you Mr know it all NOT BWFC71 . stay in Manchester were you belong .or do you not live in that Dump of a City . as i know Quite a few that moved to Bolton from Manchester because of that reason FACT.

I fear that the new plans are not enough. Bolton like many towns needs to create a unique experience. Life in England is different to the rest of the World. Looking at our culture, it seems that many people when leaving work head straight home, unless they're going grocery shopping. There is nothing in Bolton Town centre or in it's attached villages such as Westhoughton and Horwich that attracts people to stay out or visit after work. Shops and Coffee bars close at 5pm and our Towns and villages are deserted. Only the big Superstores attract anyone to them.

I think the Council should address a few more concerns than shopping. The Internet is taking over our lives and businesses can live in competition with online retailers. Harking back to history isn't going to solve the problems of our Towns and Cities. Retailers will have to come up with a unique shopping experience that will be able to combine the internet with a more personal shopping experience. The town doesn't need another specialist cinema and I think it will go bust very quickly like the swimming pool did that use to be next to Morrisons. The Town needs an exhibition centre, that could provide a unique experience and bring in many visitors to the Town. This exhibition centre could be used for events like the British Franchise Exhibition, World Cup Skateboarding Championships, Table Tennis Championships etc. This would be flexible enough to be a Cinema in the evenings and to reserve a portion of the building for that use alone. It could also be used for Businesses who want to hold conferences there.

I also think that Bolton needs more events like the Food Drink Festivals, which again could stimulate more people to come to the town and I'm sure would provide valuable income and jobs. Shops would then have the incentive to open later and the general public would be more inclined to stay in town and perhaps shop and drink coffee at their leisure.

fatboybwfc wrote:

ronnell_uk wrote:
Bolton is not in Lancashire and has not been for over forty years.

Do these Boltonians, when sending postcards back home, put Kingdom of Mercia instead of England (or UK) because they refuse to recognise changes?

Most towns that left Lancashire at the same time as Bolton have moved on. Warrington, Widnes, Barrow, Liverpool, Ashton.

What would be so great for Bolton by being in Lancashire? Similar (proper) Lancashire sized towns like Blackburn and Burnley aren't particularly exciting.

How many Boltonians work or shop in Lancaster? The roads and trains to Manchester are full every morning.

we are not mancs
we dont want to be mancs
if you are, move there saddo
BOLTON LANCASHIRE ENGLAND,by the grace of god.

Unfortunately, fatboy, you are a MANC!!!!! Bolton is in the county of GREATER MANCHESTER and has been since the queen decreed so in 1974 (probably long before you were born).

Oh and by the way, at least I am a true Boltonian, as in I was born in a maternity home Bolton and not at Townleys (aka Royal Bolton Hospital) in Farnworth!!!

First MANCHESTER
Stagecoach MANCHESTER
Arriva MANCHESTER
Maytree Travel owned by MANCHESTER Community Transport
Greater MANCHESTER Ambulance Service
Greater MANCHESTER Fire Brigade
Greater MANCHESTER Police
Roads, traffic lights and public transport organised by Transport for Greater MANCHESTER
Greater MANCHESTER Combined Authority (which replaced Association of Greater MANCHESTER Authorities)
Greater MANCHESTER Tourist Authority


And you say you live in Bolton, Lancashire England??? Doesn't seem like it to me. It is more like Bolton, Greater Manchester, Great Britain (ps its Great Britain and NOT England, you do not have an English Passport, you have a British Passport, you do not have an English Driving Licence as you have a British Driving Licence!)

Well said Westhouton Resident......The ice skating rink in Victoria Square during the Christmas period, I beleive was very successful. So why does'nt Bolton Council try and get the ice skating firm, and with council assistance, try and see about converting the old Williams car showroom on Bradshawgate into an ice rink. or the close Palais, come on councillors use some initiative.

bwfc58 wrote:
Greater Manchester Council were Dismantled in 1984 Fact and Bolton was the first council to pull out because Manchester were taking most of the money to help pay off the rent arrears of the Manchester people by £11000.000. Fact . and yes it was set up as a administrative only Fact. the very big company's in Bolton put Lancashire on there Letters and websites Fact. and the Signs that were once put up on the motorways entering Bolton saying you are now entering Greater Manchester. had to be taken down as there is no such County of that Stupid name once again Fact . so to you Mr know it all NOT BWFC71 . stay in Manchester were you belong .or do you not live in that Dump of a City . as i know Quite a few that moved to Bolton from Manchester because of that reason FACT.

You had better read your History. No-one pulled out of Greater Manchester Council, it was disbanded by the Government at the time, but the County stayed!!! Bolton did not come out of Greater Manchester - FACT!!! All the local authorities within the County of Greater Manchester became unitarian authorities at the same time - FACT! It was never an adimistartive County - it was a county that has its Royal assignment, just like any other County - in what way was the old Lancashire and teh present Lancashire NOT administrative??

Very big companies put Bolton, Lancashire! Are you a child? I would suggest you look up most conglomerate businesses in the town and you will see they do not quote a county as it is NOT required as advised by the Post Office - it is fact that Counties were no longer required on postal addresses from 1996!!!

I was born in Bolton, as said in a previous post, in 1971 and as such a TRUE Boltonian (I wasn't even born in Farnworth but in Bolton itself), but I don't live in the past and I make the present and the future what it is, bright and ever changing and for the better!

Phil from Smithills wrote:
No shooting in the foot for me. Lancashire s borders did not alter in 1974.The Yorkshire parts, for administrative purposes, Rochdale administer. And Gtr Manchester is made up of towns of south Lancashire & north Cheshire ( Altringham, Stockport Hyde) you may well refer to as Gtr Manchester but they say Cheshire.
As I pointed out...on the other side of the Pennines, they too were divided into seperate administative counties but collectively we call it Yorkshire, this principle also applies on this side of the Pennines, its all part of the same 1974 legistlation, no matter what the administrative counties are called ( you may use Gtr Manchester if you wish) collectively we are still all Lancashire.
It was clearly stated at the time by ministers, that these were for administrative purposes and did not alter the borders of the traditional counties. Lancashire this side of the Pennines and Yorkshire on the other.

We are not Lancashire not in anyway whatsoever in this modern world.

We are Greater Manchester in teh North West of England. Is Humberside in Yorkshire? No it is Humberside!

It is like saying that Canary Wharf is in London, when it is actually in Tower Hamlets, a separate borough, and county, from the City of London. But they are both in Greater London!

Phil from Smithills wrote:
No shooting in the foot for me. Lancashire s borders did not alter in 1974.The Yorkshire parts, for administrative purposes, Rochdale administer. And Gtr Manchester is made up of towns of south Lancashire & north Cheshire ( Altringham, Stockport Hyde) you may well refer to as Gtr Manchester but they say Cheshire.
As I pointed out...on the other side of the Pennines, they too were divided into seperate administative counties but collectively we call it Yorkshire, this principle also applies on this side of the Pennines, its all part of the same 1974 legistlation, no matter what the administrative counties are called ( you may use Gtr Manchester if you wish) collectively we are still all Lancashire.
It was clearly stated at the time by ministers, that these were for administrative purposes and did not alter the borders of the traditional counties. Lancashire this side of the Pennines and Yorkshire on the other.

Can you please spell Altrincham properly!

It is spelt with a C and not a G!!!

FACT i was Born and Bred in Bolton just off Crompton way in 1958 . you prat and Bolton Lancashire is and all ways will be you prat . and there is no such County Called Greater Manchester you Prat you think you know it all . well you do not look on Company's like Kia up at Middlebrook there letter head says Bolton Lancashire look on Vernecare just off water loo street a very big Company there Letter head says Bolton Lancashire and i could go on and on you Prat . so i think you should go and live in your beloved Manchester as you like it so much you Prat and should i say FACT you Prat ,

bwfc58 wrote:
FACT i was Born and Bred in Bolton just off Crompton way in 1958 . you prat and Bolton Lancashire is and all ways will be you prat . and there is no such County Called Greater Manchester you Prat you think you know it all . well you do not look on Company's like Kia up at Middlebrook there letter head says Bolton Lancashire look on Vernecare just off water loo street a very big Company there Letter head says Bolton Lancashire and i could go on and on you Prat . so i think you should go and live in your beloved Manchester as you like it so much you Prat and should i say FACT you Prat ,

There that's told you 71!
It would appear that you don't have much pride in where you belong, probably because you've been working in the EU for too long. Have you been brainwashed by chance?
Let's put this to bed; any self respecting person from Bolton considers their address BOLTON, LANCS.
We don't refer to the name GM, it's a place that belongs to Mancs & Salford 'bleeders' and they're welcome to it.

Seems the councillors have accepted that we are a suburb of Manchester rather than a Town in our own right. Think this will upset most Bolton residents. We should have a referundum on whether we want to be a suburb of Manchester or not.

Phil from Smithills wrote:
Well said Westhouton Resident......The ice skating rink in Victoria Square during the Christmas period, I beleive was very successful. So why does'nt Bolton Council try and get the ice skating firm, and with council assistance, try and see about converting the old Williams car showroom on Bradshawgate into an ice rink. or the close Palais, come on councillors use some initiative.

Even better Phil from Smithills, if we had the exhibition / multi use facility I talk about that is one of the many events that could be held there and would be morer sustainable than just a specialist cinema. As for new business premises, do me a favour, theres loads of empty office blocks both in Manchester and Bolton. Working from home is going to take a lot of jobs and will be increasingly the norm. If Government encouraged Manufacturing jobs I can see a place for it but more office blocks so that we can become a suburb of Manchester - no thanks.

BWFC71... sorry slip of the typing fingers ...Altrincham.
.
Pre 1974., the southern towns of Lancashire ( Bolton, Wigan,Salford etc ) administered their own Police, Firebrigade etc., not administered by Lancashire County Council, but we still in Lancashire.
In 1974 all the southern towns of Lancashire & north Cheshire ( Hyde, Altrincham Stockport etc ) merged these services and for administrative purposes under the name Gtr Manchester. That did not alter our belonging to Lancashire as the boundries did not change.

I make the comparison with Yorkshire who were in 1974 also divided into different "counties" but we refer to it collectively as Yorkshire.

That same principle applies here too, but if you prefer to be Gtr Man., that up to you , but most people in the southern towns Bolton,Wigan,Rochdal
e etc still say qite correctly..... Lancashire.

why cater for students, as if they have money to spend ?? there arent any decent restaurantes in bolton nor is there any where to dance, or have fun without being drunk . as we baby boomers have the most money as a section of the population I find it incredible we arent catered for , I dont go into bolton any more as it is expensive to park and has poor shops ( the market hall a beautiful victorian establishment is full of empty shops that people just walk through.. like an airport foyer ,its abysmal) and nothing else to attract me , but lots to deter me , beggars , drunks outside pubs learing, louts swearing on the town hall square . would love to see bolton rise again but Im afraid this council hasnt the imagination .

bwfc58 wrote:
FACT i was Born and Bred in Bolton just off Crompton way in 1958 . you prat and Bolton Lancashire is and all ways will be you prat . and there is no such County Called Greater Manchester you Prat you think you know it all . well you do not look on Company's like Kia up at Middlebrook there letter head says Bolton Lancashire look on Vernecare just off water loo street a very big Company there Letter head says Bolton Lancashire and i could go on and on you Prat . so i think you should go and live in your beloved Manchester as you like it so much you Prat and should i say FACT you Prat ,

BWFC58, it looks as though you have lost the plot big style and you seem to ranting over the past, rather than the present. I can now say, legally and profoundly that you are a LIAR!!!!

Sadly I checked out what you said about Kia Motors and Vernacare and guess what? Their addresses or contacts do not mention Lancashire. In fact, this is Vernacare's address (taken straight from their letterhead!):- Vernacare, Folds Road, Bolton BL1 2TX Phone +44(0)1204 52494 Fax +44 (0)1204 521862
and this is Kia Motors address (taken from the letterhead):-
79 The Linkway, Middlebrook Retail Park, Horwich, Bolton, BL6 6JA Sales 01204 828941 After Sales 01204 664829

So you are calling those companies liars if you insist on your pathetic argument!!!

Again I can go on proving you completely incorrect, my dear friend.

I am Bolton born and bred and proud to come from, live in Bolton, but I do not hark to the past (with or wothout rose-tinted spectacles). Bolton is an unitarian authority in the County of Greater Manchester (courtesey of Royal Decree)

Greater Manchester Police - The service was formed in 1974 by the amalgamation of Manchester and Salford Police with parts of Lancashire Constabulary, Cheshire Constabulary and West Yorkshire Constabulary. Bolton NEVER had its own police constabulalry

Greater Manchester Fire Brigade - The service was created when the county of Greater Manchester came into being in 1974. It had, until fairly recently, been called the Greater Manchester County Fire Service. The service was originally administered by the Greater Manchester County Council, but when this was abolished in 1986, administration of the service was taken over by a joint authority of the ten Metropolitan Boroughs of Greater Manchester, known as the "Fire and Rescue Authority". Five members are appointed by Manchester City Council, two each by Bury and Rochdale Metropolitan Borough Councils, and three each by the remaining seven borough councils of Greater Manchester.

GMCA - The Greater Manchester Combined Authority (GMCA) is the top-tier administrative body for the local governance of Greater Manchester, England. The combined authority was established on 1 April 2011 and consists of ten indirectly elected members, each a directly elected councillor from one of the ten metropolitan boroughs that comprise Greater Manchester.

AGMA - The Association of Greater Manchester Authorities (AGMA) is the local government association for Greater Manchester, a metropolitan county in North West England. It was established in 1986 as a voluntary organisation to represent the ten district councils of Greater Manchester after the Greater Manchester County Council was abolished.

GREATER MANCHESTER - Greater Manchester is a metropolitan county in North West England, with a population of 2.68 million. It encompasses one of the largest metropolitan areas in the United Kingdom and comprises ten metropolitan boroughs: Bolton, Bury, Oldham, Rochdale, Stockport, Tameside, Trafford, Wigan, and the cities of Manchester and Salford. Greater Manchester was created on 1 April 1974 as a result of the Local Government Act 1972. For the 12 years following 1974 the county had a two-tier system of local government; district councils shared power with the Greater Manchester County Council. The county council was abolished in 1986, and so its districts (the metropolitan boroughs) effectively became unitary authority areas. However, the metropolitan county has continued to exist in law and as a geographic frame of reference, and as a ceremonial county, has a Lord Lieutenant and a High Sheriff.

All of this information has come from official Government publications just so to show that what anyone might say Greater Manchester is a true and proper County which does encompass Bolton!! No lies , no trickery and no nonsense, just plain basic very true facts!

BWFC71
To say Bolton never had its own police force is totally wrong, again. I had an uncle who was in the Bolton police force, I know what I am talking about, it had its own chief constable.
.
As you have quoted from a
government publication, I will also.......
▪ The legislation that currently defines counties for the purposes of the administration of local government is the Local Government Act 1972 (as amended by various Orders in the 1990s). This legislation abolished the previous administrative counties, which were established by the Local Government Act 1933. However, these Acts did not specifically abolish traditional counties, so traditional counties still exist, but no longer for the purpose of the administration of local government. (Parjit Dhanda MP, PUSS at the Department for Communities & Local Government - 16th April 2008

babyboom boom wrote:
why cater for students, as if they have money to spend ?? there arent any decent restaurantes in bolton nor is there any where to dance, or have fun without being drunk . as we baby boomers have the most money as a section of the population I find it incredible we arent catered for , I dont go into bolton any more as it is expensive to park and has poor shops ( the market hall a beautiful victorian establishment is full of empty shops that people just walk through.. like an airport foyer ,its abysmal) and nothing else to attract me , but lots to deter me , beggars , drunks outside pubs learing, louts swearing on the town hall square . would love to see bolton rise again but Im afraid this council hasnt the imagination .

Find the remark about car parking a little ridiculous. Go to Manchester and know what real car parking fees are like. Some all day parking is as much as £80 and you'll be lucky to park your car for less than £5 an hour.

Sadly the rest I agree, but then there is a recession and eating in is the new eating out. As for dancing, well the Palais was doing that and its had to shut, presumably because no one wanted to dance. As I say in my earlier letter, I think we need to think a bit further. Get people to come into the Town in the first place with Food and Drink festivals, European Markets, Real Festivals, perhaps a Brass Band, Fairs etc, that might just get people visiting the Town and visiting cafes, restauraunts and may take some of the more obnoxious elements of society out of the picture. We need to get family entertainment into the Town.

Phil from Smithills wrote:
BWFC71
To say Bolton never had its own police force is totally wrong, again. I had an uncle who was in the Bolton police force, I know what I am talking about, it had its own chief constable.
.
As you have quoted from a
government publication, I will also.......
▪ The legislation that currently defines counties for the purposes of the administration of local government is the Local Government Act 1972 (as amended by various Orders in the 1990s). This legislation abolished the previous administrative counties, which were established by the Local Government Act 1933. However, these Acts did not specifically abolish traditional counties, so traditional counties still exist, but no longer for the purpose of the administration of local government. (Parjit Dhanda MP, PUSS at the Department for Communities & Local Government - 16th April 2008

I can guarantee you the fact that Bolton NEVER had its own police force. It alsways was part of the Lancashire Police Force - and before then the Lancshire version of the Bow Street Runners!!!! I should know as I had a relative who actually worked for the Lancshire Constabulary in Bolton, Leigh, Wigan and in Lancaster, before working for GMP!

And talking of "traditional" counties - Yorkshire, for the last 250 years, was never a single county, so that argument of yours is wrong as well!!!!! West Riding, North Riding, East Ridiong were all SEPARATE counties before being reformed in 1974 to North Yorkshire, West Yorkshire, Humberside and South Yorkshire.

But thats all in the past - again rose tinted spectacles give a far different view than actual reality. We are currently in the 21st Century and Bolton IS currently part of teh county of Greater Manchester - we don't know whats going to happen in teh future - if we did then we would all be millionaires with winning the lottery!!! But I fight for my town and fight for iomprovement but teh reality is we have to compete with other towns and cities with Greater Manchester for custom - we have to be unique to get people here but we have to do it whilst being part of Greater Manchester as that is not going to change - no matter how one harks to the past. We are currently, and legally speaking, Bolton - Greater Manchester!

Also, for the period between the withdarwal of the top-tier of local government, aka Greater Manchester County Council, and the formation of AGMA, which county were we part of? - Greater Manchester!!!

Go to any border point northside of Bolton and you will see differing signs - Chorley border you will see - Welcome to Lancashire - Welcome to Borough of Preston - Welcome to Chorley. and in the opposite Direction you will see - Welcome to Bolton, Greater Manchester.

Go along the A666 and at the border you will see Welcome to Lancashire - Welcome to the Borough of Blackburn with Darwen - whilsst opposite direction you will see Welcome to Bolton, Greater Manchester

These are true as I noticed on my travels today, for work.


One question - where is Turton?

BWFC71 wrote:

Phil from Smithills wrote:
BWFC71
To say Bolton never had its own police force is totally wrong, again. I had an uncle who was in the Bolton police force, I know what I am talking about, it had its own chief constable.
.
As you have quoted from a
government publication, I will also.......
▪ The legislation that currently defines counties for the purposes of the administration of local government is the Local Government Act 1972 (as amended by various Orders in the 1990s). This legislation abolished the previous administrative counties, which were established by the Local Government Act 1933. However, these Acts did not specifically abolish traditional counties, so traditional counties still exist, but no longer for the purpose of the administration of local government. (Parjit Dhanda MP, PUSS at the Department for Communities & Local Government - 16th April 2008

I can guarantee you the fact that Bolton NEVER had its own police force. It alsways was part of the Lancashire Police Force - and before then the Lancshire version of the Bow Street Runners!!!! I should know as I had a relative who actually worked for the Lancshire Constabulary in Bolton, Leigh, Wigan and in Lancaster, before working for GMP!

And talking of "traditional" counties - Yorkshire, for the last 250 years, was never a single county, so that argument of yours is wrong as well!!!!! West Riding, North Riding, East Ridiong were all SEPARATE counties before being reformed in 1974 to North Yorkshire, West Yorkshire, Humberside and South Yorkshire.

But thats all in the past - again rose tinted spectacles give a far different view than actual reality. We are currently in the 21st Century and Bolton IS currently part of teh county of Greater Manchester - we don't know whats going to happen in teh future - if we did then we would all be millionaires with winning the lottery!!! But I fight for my town and fight for iomprovement but teh reality is we have to compete with other towns and cities with Greater Manchester for custom - we have to be unique to get people here but we have to do it whilst being part of Greater Manchester as that is not going to change - no matter how one harks to the past. We are currently, and legally speaking, Bolton - Greater Manchester!

Also, for the period between the withdarwal of the top-tier of local government, aka Greater Manchester County Council, and the formation of AGMA, which county were we part of? - Greater Manchester!!!

Go to any border point northside of Bolton and you will see differing signs - Chorley border you will see - Welcome to Lancashire - Welcome to Borough of Preston - Welcome to Chorley. and in the opposite Direction you will see - Welcome to Bolton, Greater Manchester.

Go along the A666 and at the border you will see Welcome to Lancashire - Welcome to the Borough of Blackburn with Darwen - whilsst opposite direction you will see Welcome to Bolton, Greater Manchester

These are true as I noticed on my travels today, for work.


One question - where is Turton?

This should be about how to get Bolton busier again, not whether they're in Greater Manchester or Lancashire.

But its all about the same thing in the end......

BOLTON PRIDE!!!!

Once we can all get over the switch of counties which happened 40 years ago, then we can all concentrate on getting Bolton to being great again.

I agree it doesn't matter which county we are in, but there is no point in harkin to the past, which wasn't that great, to be fair, when we were ruled from Lancaster (over 50 miles up north!.

I have liked your posts so far and agree with you completely - even suggested many myself on other news items about the town.

But to move forward we need one identity, our current one, and from their we can move forward!

The train station area needs looking at. Train stations are gateways to towns, the area visitors first see and gain their first impressions from. Newport Street needs sprucing up and needs to look livelier, with more shops or offices. Hopefully the relocation of the bus services from Moor Lane to the interchange will improve footfall.

The nightime economy seems to be dominated by volume drinking establishments and takeaways. Though the poetry idea is beyond belief, there could be more live music. A town Bolton's size should be able to support more theatre and a possible opera. Independent restaurants could attract customers currently using the chain restaurants on offer at Middlebrook and the Trafford Centre.

A daytime attraction like a decent museum might help. I appreciate there might not be money in the pot at the moment.

Bolton's positive is that it already has arguably the most pedestrian friendly town centre in the Manchester area. It is not dominated by one shopping arcade. With a clean up of some of the main streets it could be a handsome centre.

Key in on the internet Kia Bolton . then key in Vernacare Bolton . and look very Clearly and guess what you will see BWFC71. you will see there addresses say Bolton Lancashire . and just for the record when i bought a brand new car from Kia near the Reebok it did say Bolton Greater Manchester . but now they have changed it to guess what Bolton Lancashire . so when i go up to Kia next week i will be asking them why they changed there addresses Letter head to Bolton Lancashire .and there are many company's in and around Bolton that say Lancashire . and just for the fact when i have to go to manchester to meetings all i see is lots of empty Coffee shops and empty shops just like Bolton . this word Greater Manchester only Benifits one place you Guessed it Manchester . and that is why Bolton Town Centre is Struggling because all the funds that are given out does not go to Towns like Bolton Wigan and the others but once again you Guessed right Manchester and that is a Fact

Sorry but I will have to correct you again,
BOLTON Borough Police Force was founded in 1839 and existed until 1969.

It became part of the amalgamated Lancashire Constabulary in one shake-up and the town's policing then transferred to the Greater Manchester force a few years' later.

Bolton, as a County Borough, was NEVER ruled by Lancashire County Council, we administered our own affairs until placed into the administative Gtr Man that is what it was created for, but remain part of Lancashire.
Another quote........
I can confirm that these Acts (1933, 1972) did not specifically abolish traditional counties so traditional counties still exist but no longer for the purposes of the administration of local Government ...” (Department for Communities and Local Government – 22nd August 2006)

I quite agree Bolton should be more vibrant. I would hope with the university and the old Pack Horse Hotel planning accomidating students, this could be the start of a brighter future for the town centre.

Keeping students in the town centre is good, but a double edged sword. There's a danger of creating a student ghetto like Fallowfield or somewhere full of volume drinking pubs/clubs where only those with an NUS card can get in.

I would hope Bolton raise the bar (literally) by diversifying the nightlife. More restaurants, more events, places like the Pack Horse and Ye Olde Man and Sythe playing on their traditions, more (Bolton brewed) real ale on offer.
Not just places attracting students enmasse with beer offers to get them legless.

I appreciate that Boltonians dislike the Greater Manchester name as if favours one place in the region, but you could say the same our borough being called "Bolton".

ronnell_uk wrote:
The train station area needs looking at. Train stations are gateways to towns, the area visitors first see and gain their first impressions from. Newport Street needs sprucing up and needs to look livelier, with more shops or offices. Hopefully the relocation of the bus services from Moor Lane to the interchange will improve footfall.

The nightime economy seems to be dominated by volume drinking establishments and takeaways. Though the poetry idea is beyond belief, there could be more live music. A town Bolton's size should be able to support more theatre and a possible opera. Independent restaurants could attract customers currently using the chain restaurants on offer at Middlebrook and the Trafford Centre.

A daytime attraction like a decent museum might help. I appreciate there might not be money in the pot at the moment.

Bolton's positive is that it already has arguably the most pedestrian friendly town centre in the Manchester area. It is not dominated by one shopping arcade. With a clean up of some of the main streets it could be a handsome centre.

Actually it has a very good museum and a great Aquarium which are free of charge. They need to be expanded upon, that I would agree. I also agree with more theatre and that is why I think a multiuse exhibition centre would be better than a specialist cinema. If we're going to spend money, lets use what little we have wisely.

Phil from Smithills wrote:
Sorry but I will have to correct you again,
BOLTON Borough Police Force was founded in 1839 and existed until 1969.

It became part of the amalgamated Lancashire Constabulary in one shake-up and the town's policing then transferred to the Greater Manchester force a few years' later.

Bolton, as a County Borough, was NEVER ruled by Lancashire County Council, we administered our own affairs until placed into the administative Gtr Man that is what it was created for, but remain part of Lancashire.
Another quote........
I can confirm that these Acts (1933, 1972) did not specifically abolish traditional counties so traditional counties still exist but no longer for the purposes of the administration of local Government ...” (Department for Communities and Local Government – 22nd August 2006)

I quite agree Bolton should be more vibrant. I would hope with the university and the old Pack Horse Hotel planning accomidating students, this could be the start of a brighter future for the town centre.

Apologies to correct you, yet again, Phil but up until Greater Manchester County Council was abolished we were goverened by Lancashire County Council, up until 1974 (although since 1889 some duties were given to County Borough fo Bolton to give slight more autonomy although the LCC had the final say if disputes arose) and then between 1974 and 1986 we were goverened by Greater Manchester County Council. Before 1986 Bolton had a two-tier local government system - Bolton Council and County Council and the County Council could over-rule Bolton Council whenever they felt it needed to be over-ruled. Since 1986 Bolton has been a Unitarian Authority, hence a one-tier local government system!!!

Also do not forget that, a you keep quoting DfC&LG, that only applies to Borough councils that still exist after the shake-up in 1974. As it is the Bolton of pre-1974 does NOT exist as that was County Borough of Bolton which encopmpassed - Little Bolton, Great Bolton, Westhoughton, Astley Bridge, Turton and Bolton Rural District. Erstwhile Metropolitan Borough of Bolton, which was established in 1974, under the 1972 Act, was a brand new Borough which encompassed County Borough of Bolton, Blackrod, Farnworth, Horwich and Kearsley.

Therefore in short under current legality, and to be more precise than of previous days of this discussion is that Bolton is currently part of Metropolitan Borough of Bolton in Greater Manchester. The old Bolton of the County Borough of Bolton, Lancashire was abolished, hence we are of the Greater Manchester community whether we like it or not! Plus all this talk of historic Lancashire etc etc is null and void as Metropolitan Borough of Bolton has NEVER been part of Lancashire!

BWFC71 wrote:

Phil from Smithills wrote:
Sorry but I will have to correct you again,
BOLTON Borough Police Force was founded in 1839 and existed until 1969.

It became part of the amalgamated Lancashire Constabulary in one shake-up and the town's policing then transferred to the Greater Manchester force a few years' later.

Bolton, as a County Borough, was NEVER ruled by Lancashire County Council, we administered our own affairs until placed into the administative Gtr Man that is what it was created for, but remain part of Lancashire.
Another quote........
I can confirm that these Acts (1933, 1972) did not specifically abolish traditional counties so traditional counties still exist but no longer for the purposes of the administration of local Government ...” (Department for Communities and Local Government – 22nd August 2006)

I quite agree Bolton should be more vibrant. I would hope with the university and the old Pack Horse Hotel planning accomidating students, this could be the start of a brighter future for the town centre.

Apologies to correct you, yet again, Phil but up until Greater Manchester County Council was abolished we were goverened by Lancashire County Council, up until 1974 (although since 1889 some duties were given to County Borough fo Bolton to give slight more autonomy although the LCC had the final say if disputes arose) and then between 1974 and 1986 we were goverened by Greater Manchester County Council. Before 1986 Bolton had a two-tier local government system - Bolton Council and County Council and the County Council could over-rule Bolton Council whenever they felt it needed to be over-ruled. Since 1986 Bolton has been a Unitarian Authority, hence a one-tier local government system!!!

Also do not forget that, a you keep quoting DfC&LG, that only applies to Borough councils that still exist after the shake-up in 1974. As it is the Bolton of pre-1974 does NOT exist as that was County Borough of Bolton which encopmpassed - Little Bolton, Great Bolton, Westhoughton, Astley Bridge, Turton and Bolton Rural District. Erstwhile Metropolitan Borough of Bolton, which was established in 1974, under the 1972 Act, was a brand new Borough which encompassed County Borough of Bolton, Blackrod, Farnworth, Horwich and Kearsley.

Therefore in short under current legality, and to be more precise than of previous days of this discussion is that Bolton is currently part of Metropolitan Borough of Bolton in Greater Manchester. The old Bolton of the County Borough of Bolton, Lancashire was abolished, hence we are of the Greater Manchester community whether we like it or not! Plus all this talk of historic Lancashire etc etc is null and void as Metropolitan Borough of Bolton has NEVER been part of Lancashire!

Erm, historically, Bolton is part of Lancashire. Even Manchester itself is part of the Lancashire region!!

Regionally Manchester, Bolton, Salford etc etc are 'Lancashire'!.

There are ordnance survey and older maps to support this (check out the Lancashire County hundreds map).

lancashire.gov.uk/en
vironment/oldmap/oth
ers/hundreds.jpg

BWFC71 wrote:
Greater Manchester Police - The service was formed in 1974 by the amalgamation of Manchester and Salford Police with parts of Lancashire Constabulary, Cheshire Constabulary and West Yorkshire Constabulary. Bolton NEVER had its own police constabulalry Greater Manchester Fire Brigade - The service was created when the county of Greater Manchester came into being in 1974. It had, until fairly recently, been called the Greater Manchester County Fire Service. The service was originally administered by the Greater Manchester County Council, but when this was abolished in 1986, administration of the service was taken over by a joint authority of the ten Metropolitan Boroughs of Greater Manchester, known as the "Fire and Rescue Authority". Five members are appointed by Manchester City Council, two each by Bury and Rochdale Metropolitan Borough Councils, and three each by the remaining seven borough councils of Greater Manchester. GMCA - The Greater Manchester Combined Authority (GMCA) is the top-tier administrative body for the local governance of Greater Manchester, England. The combined authority was established on 1 April 2011 and consists of ten indirectly elected members, each a directly elected councillor from one of the ten metropolitan boroughs that comprise Greater Manchester. AGMA - The Association of Greater Manchester Authorities (AGMA) is the local government association for Greater Manchester, a metropolitan county in North West England. It was established in 1986 as a voluntary organisation to represent the ten district councils of Greater Manchester after the Greater Manchester County Council was abolished. GREATER MANCHESTER - Greater Manchester is a metropolitan county in North West England, with a population of 2.68 million. It encompasses one of the largest metropolitan areas in the United Kingdom and comprises ten metropolitan boroughs: Bolton, Bury, Oldham, Rochdale, Stockport, Tameside, Trafford, Wigan, and the cities of Manchester and Salford. Greater Manchester was created on 1 April 1974 as a result of the Local Government Act 1972. For the 12 years following 1974 the county had a two-tier system of local government; district councils shared power with the Greater Manchester County Council. The county council was abolished in 1986, and so its districts (the metropolitan boroughs) effectively became unitary authority areas. However, the metropolitan county has continued to exist in law and as a geographic frame of reference, and as a ceremonial county, has a Lord Lieutenant and a High Sheriff. All of this information has come from official Government publications just so to show that what anyone might say Greater Manchester is a true and proper County which does encompass Bolton!! No lies , no trickery and no nonsense, just plain basic very true facts!

Quite wrong, BWFC71. Bolton had a Borough Police force until 1968, when it was folded into the county force.

I suggest you broaden your research beyond Wikkipedia.

The legal status of "Greater Manchester" is irrelevant while it continues to be viewed as the imposition of someone's else's identity, as it certainly does in Bolton. I assume, whatever the economic predominance of that country, that you would object to living in "Greater Germany", rather than Europe.

BWFC71..As someone has said you seem to be quoting from Wikipedia.,
As someone who was born in the late 40's I am very conversant with recent history of Bolton.
Bolton Borough Police force was independent from Lancashire CC or its constabulary, with our own chief constable, overseen by the Bolton watch committee., until 1969 when, for a short time was merged into the Lancashire constabulary then into the newly formed Gtr Manchester force about 1974.
.
As a County Borough,Bolton administered ALL it own affairs with NO involvement of Lancashire CC., but remained in the traditional county of Lancashire , which is different from the administrative county region.
.
As I have indicated in government statements, that the traditional counties were never abolished, but newly formed administative one introduce.
.
That is why Bolton and the other surrounding towns are still in the traditional county. Its a Palatine county which covers the whole of the administative counties of Gtr Man & Merseyside.
.
You have to understand that the 1974 act was titled Local Government reorganisation, and Parliament assured everyone that it does NOT effect the traditional counties.
.
Here is another governemt quote.........
“There is no doubt about the importance of historic counties… as part of our history and cultural life. I agree that they provide many people with a strong sense of identity and local pride. Indeed the continued use of traditional county names and areas in tourism, sport, business, literature and the arts, to name but a few examples, bears testament to that. Of course we should all be proud of where we come from.” (Gillian Merron MP, Private Secretary to the Cabinet Office – Hansard 29th June 2007)
.
You may be to young to remember pre 1974 but government assurances given then still apply today..You can use Gtr Man if you like but the majority prefer to use our traditional county of Lancashire which is much larger that the part that Lancashre CC covers.

.

1. I don't use Wikipedia for political querying due to the fact that anybody can, and do, change actual facts. The Lancashire Constabulary was established in 1839 and covered the "historic" area of Lancashire and split into Divisions, of which Bolton was a division!!!!

I suggest you read on your history through actual given texts from the various police forces of their history and through websites that end in .gov.uk rather than the Daily Fail and various 3rd-party publications which do tend to skim alot of in-depth history!!!.


Also considering this great country of ours have been ruled by overseas Empires such as the Italians (Roman Empire), Germans (Saxon Empire to which are modern English is an actual dialect of!), Finland, Denmark and Sweden (the Viking Empire) our current model of the EU is just a further extension of human history in the so-called Western society! Plus lets not forget tha Gauls (William The Conquerer), The Dutch (William IV of Orange and Great Britain) and influence of the Greek and the Ottoman Empire - then of course Soanish conquering United States and then us British taking teh land off them - same with Australia which was actually discovered by teh Dutch, and how much Dutch land did we conquer in Africa!!! We all live in poltical zones that we do not wish to be in but we have to make the most of the situation and to improve it for ourselves - all teh future political alignments will, I can guarantee, not fit teh bill for teh majority of people but thats how thw world has been, currently is and will be in the future!!!

Phil from Smithills wrote:
BWFC71..As someone has said you seem to be quoting from Wikipedia.,
As someone who was born in the late 40's I am very conversant with recent history of Bolton.
Bolton Borough Police force was independent from Lancashire CC or its constabulary, with our own chief constable, overseen by the Bolton watch committee., until 1969 when, for a short time was merged into the Lancashire constabulary then into the newly formed Gtr Manchester force about 1974.
.
As a County Borough,Bolton administered ALL it own affairs with NO involvement of Lancashire CC., but remained in the traditional county of Lancashire , which is different from the administrative county region.
.
As I have indicated in government statements, that the traditional counties were never abolished, but newly formed administative one introduce.
.
That is why Bolton and the other surrounding towns are still in the traditional county. Its a Palatine county which covers the whole of the administative counties of Gtr Man & Merseyside.
.
You have to understand that the 1974 act was titled Local Government reorganisation, and Parliament assured everyone that it does NOT effect the traditional counties.
.
Here is another governemt quote.........
“There is no doubt about the importance of historic counties… as part of our history and cultural life. I agree that they provide many people with a strong sense of identity and local pride. Indeed the continued use of traditional county names and areas in tourism, sport, business, literature and the arts, to name but a few examples, bears testament to that. Of course we should all be proud of where we come from.” (Gillian Merron MP, Private Secretary to the Cabinet Office – Hansard 29th June 2007)
.
You may be to young to remember pre 1974 but government assurances given then still apply today..You can use Gtr Man if you like but the majority prefer to use our traditional county of Lancashire which is much larger that the part that Lancashre CC covers.

.

As I have said I do not quote from Wikipedia but direct from .gov.uk websites, and other true and proper websites such as the Lancashire Constabulary, Bolton.gov, AGMA, and other Government bodies which have the actual answers.

BWFC71 wrote:

bwfc58 wrote:
FACT i was Born and Bred in Bolton just off Crompton way in 1958 . you prat and Bolton Lancashire is and all ways will be you prat . and there is no such County Called Greater Manchester you Prat you think you know it all . well you do not look on Company's like Kia up at Middlebrook there letter head says Bolton Lancashire look on Vernecare just off water loo street a very big Company there Letter head says Bolton Lancashire and i could go on and on you Prat . so i think you should go and live in your beloved Manchester as you like it so much you Prat and should i say FACT you Prat ,

BWFC58, it looks as though you have lost the plot big style and you seem to ranting over the past, rather than the present. I can now say, legally and profoundly that you are a LIAR!!!!

Sadly I checked out what you said about Kia Motors and Vernacare and guess what? Their addresses or contacts do not mention Lancashire. In fact, this is Vernacare's address (taken straight from their letterhead!):- Vernacare, Folds Road, Bolton BL1 2TX Phone +44(0)1204 52494 Fax +44 (0)1204 521862
and this is Kia Motors address (taken from the letterhead):-
79 The Linkway, Middlebrook Retail Park, Horwich, Bolton, BL6 6JA Sales 01204 828941 After Sales 01204 664829

So you are calling those companies liars if you insist on your pathetic argument!!!

Again I can go on proving you completely incorrect, my dear friend.

I am Bolton born and bred and proud to come from, live in Bolton, but I do not hark to the past (with or wothout rose-tinted spectacles). Bolton is an unitarian authority in the County of Greater Manchester (courtesey of Royal Decree)

phil is right, greater mcr is administrive only we are lancastrians as we live in the palatine of the duke of lancaster.this is why we toast the queen and the duke of lancaster on special occasions.if you want to be a manc leave r kid and move to drug city

Mrs Thatcher caused all this when she changed the Boundary's to suit her Party in 1974 . and i do remember Labour saying to the British public that they would change them back but they lied did'nt they just like all ways do . and when Greater Manchester Council where Scrapped in 1986 . because Manchester Council were taking most of the money robbing swines .so lets us all vote UKIP and they will put all the Boundary's back to were they once was

Dear all,

Can I make the suggestion that we write a letter (with a pen or pencil) to BFC71 at his halls of residence? Just to show that even the Royal Mail know Lancashire for what it is?

BWFC71
Room 101
Town Hall
Bolton
Lancashire
BL1 1JW

BWFC58....I sympathise with your comments, I worked in Manchester in the 70's, they had Manchester Corporation buses with open rear entrance & exit., shortly after 1974 they were using our liveried Leyland Atlantean new buses in their city. My work mates often commented how better they were from their old buses. Incedentally, if you google "Kia car dealers" input our post code and the map say.... Kia Bolton Lancashire.

BWFC71

As you were incorrect with Bolton Borough Police, as I pointed out, we had our own chief constable.
I think it was you, who said that there were road boundary signs saying Bolton Greater Manchester., as I travel in & out of Bolton I have NOT come accross any such signs, they do say Metropolitan Borough of Bolton. Another incorrect comment.

babyboom boom wrote:
why cater for students, as if they have money to spend ?? there arent any decent restaurantes in bolton nor is there any where to dance, or have fun without being drunk . as we baby boomers have the most money as a section of the population I find it incredible we arent catered for , I dont go into bolton any more as it is expensive to park and has poor shops ( the market hall a beautiful victorian establishment is full of empty shops that people just walk through.. like an airport foyer ,its abysmal) and nothing else to attract me , but lots to deter me , beggars , drunks outside pubs learing, louts swearing on the town hall square . would love to see bolton rise again but Im afraid this council hasnt the imagination .

As you stae we don't go into Bolton anymore. I live in Harwood and have not entered Bolton after 5 pm for 6 years the council leaders have never catered for its residents only visting students.
This is really poor management you retain the local economic spending then expand.
Bolton has never listened to local residents more concerned with the asian voters and mosques, and other asian religous events.

The free parking is too little to late and to be honest not very imaginative other councils have done the same the trafford center has had free parking since it opened its doors.

I don't bet and don't wear charity cloths or drink so Bolton has no appeal to myself or many other residents I know.

Moving council workers into the town hall to prop up the towns terminal decline can only be seen as a poor PR stunt.

What is needed is a planning department with some vision and drive unfortunatley theres a lot of talk and meetings but no action in the council.

I think BWFC71 should go and live in his beloved Manchester . and yes phil from smithills i to have not seen any signs saying you are now entering Greater Manchester why because there is no such County as i am a Buslness person i have to go all over mainly in and around Lancashire . BWFC71 please change your name to MUFC71 or MCFC71. as that would suit you better . do you work for the fat controller a Mr Morris by any chance what was that yes i thought so .

bwfc58 wrote:
I think BWFC71 should go and live in his beloved Manchester . and yes phil from smithills i to have not seen any signs saying you are now entering Greater Manchester why because there is no such County as i am a Buslness person i have to go all over mainly in and around Lancashire . BWFC71 please change your name to MUFC71 or MCFC71. as that would suit you better . do you work for the fat controller a Mr Morris by any chance what was that yes i thought so .

How ignorant!!!!!!

You should open you eyes more whilst driving, instead of lighting up another cigarette!

On the A666 at teh Bolton/Blackburn Boundary there is a sign which at the top has GREATER MANCHESTER, then in teh main part has BOLTON!

Why should I change to MUFC or MCFC??? Just because you are stuck in teh past and have not one ounce of wanting to be in the present and not reaklising teh truth when it hits you in the face - the it is NOT my problem, but yours.

It is about time you wake up in the real world and support BOLTON as a place rather than arguing the fact whether its Lancashire or not - I have posted the truth and you do not want to believe - that is your perogative, but you are damaging teh brand (i.e. BNolton) with your continual harking to teh past rather than the present or the future!!

So you support BWFC even though they are based in Horwich, which according to historic links, is not part of Bolton???

It seems like double standards to m, on your part!

And one more thing, which i know you will like as its not the past, and is actually the present.....

I was born in teh Country Borough of Bolton, Lancashire in 1971 - thus making me a true BOLTONIAN and LANCASTRIAN - something taht will never be taken away form me.

But since 1974 my hometime Borough was abolished and replaced with the Metropolitan Borough of Bolton (which also took over surrounding smaller boroughs) and was placed in the county of Greater Manchester which had a 2-tier politics system of town elections and county elections, but in 1986 the county council was abolished by teh county wasn't!!! The current Greater Manchester has the ROYAL seal of apprroval - therefore are you calling the monarchy liars by saying Greater Manchester doesn't exist!!! If you are, then shame on you, and shame on your relatives especially those embarrased by what you say and they serve in the British Army - headed by the monarchy!

Here is an idea - for all of those who do not want to live in the Metropolitan Borough on Bolton, Greater Manchestrr then why not move to the County Borough of Bolton, Lancashire?


ooops you can't as it no longer exists as a legal entity!

BWFC71 wrote:
Here is an idea - for all of those who do not want to live in the Metropolitan Borough on Bolton, Greater Manchestrr then why not move to the County Borough of Bolton, Lancashire?


ooops you can't as it no longer exists as a legal entity!

I think Boltonians do not like being part of Manchester as they see it as some sort of taking over. They seek refuge and solace in pretending they live in "Lancashire".

Boltonians will say "no" to being part of Manchester, which is where they work and shop. Bolton will put signs up in other towns like Farnworth, Westhoughton and Horwich welcoming visitors to "the Bolton family".

The irony is not lost.

Bolton left Lancashire at the same time as Manchester, Barrow, Warrington, Todmorden, Liverpool, Widnes. Those towns are happy being promoted out of what was the most overcrowded, dirtiest place fames for its slave trade and child labour.

Bolton loves it.

Incorrect, Bolton never left Lancashire, we were never administered by lancashire CC but remained in Lancashire. The town of Bolton is still in that traditional county. Greater Manchester which was created to merge police, transport & fire services etc into the administative Gtr Man., which is part of the traditional county. Please learn to distinguish between a traditional& an administrative county, and when you do, all will become clear. It is the same county that Lancashire Cricket Club recruits from, the same Lancashire FA that Everton., Man U., Man C., Liverpool, Bolton Wand., Wigan etc are affilliated to.

Time to learn all your counties.... Lets see how many you can get right in 2 minutes from Merseyside and Greater Manchester to North Yorkshire, and Humberside from Suffolk and Devon - no Welsh or Scottish ones, though...

Cut and paste the link, below, into the search bar and replace the spaces with dots.

http://www geography-map-games com/geography-games-
Counties-of-England-
_pageid161 html

for one BWFC71 or should i say MUFC71. i do not and never have Smoked . as i go to the gym 4 times a week and i do not drink . it is you that should get your facts right . you must work for Bolton Council and for the very big fat Controller Morris . Bolton never as left Lancashire . i do buy Lancashire Life and even Manchester well parts of it go in it and Parts of Bolton are all ways in it i wonder why i will tell you why Because Bolton is in Lancashire Fact .so MUFC71 please pack yours bags and go and live in that Grot Spot they call Manchester and work for that Council and take Morris with you

Yes its time to learn our traditional counties, some people don't seem to know them...try this site........
http: // badc.nerc.ac.uk/sear
ch/midas_stations/tr
aditional_counties_m
ap.html

Here is another link, eventually you will see that there is our traditional county and a administrative created within it.

http : //andrewgwynne.co.uk
/2012/11/27/lancashi
re-day-celebrated-by
-denton-reddish-mp/

Just rmove spaces.

Why is it that residents in any town always say they shop in another town?